Premier league final between William Henzell & Simon Gerada

[pingpongrob]

Premier League Final 2011 Game 1 - William Henzell v Simon Gerada

Premier League Final 2011 Game 2 - William Henzell v Simon Gerada

Premier League Final 2011 Game 3 - William Henzell v Simon Gerada

Premier League Final 2011 Game 4 - William Henzell v Simon Gerada

Not sure if they are in order. Sorry about the shaky camera work, it was a last minute desision to record it and all I had was my IPhone. TTV will also have another version listed soon.

Enjoy.

[PF_4]

 TTV version here

TTV Premier League Final - Simon Gerada vs William Henzell

TTV Premier League Final - Simon Gerada vs William Henzell

[JT]

You should have stayed around and filmed the final Miao Miao played against our Danish import, that was worth recording. Actually a couple of guys did film it but not sure who they were

[speedplay]

You should have stayed around and filmed the final Miao Miao played against our Danish import, that was worth recording. Actually a couple of guys did film it but not sure who they were

Who was the Dane? Male or female? Seeing as Denmark is close by, I might have heard of him/her.

[JT]

He's just a guy that was on the national team as a junior and hasn't played seriously since until last weekend. I don't think too many would remember him since he's in his 30's now. But he has an awesome style of game, very old time Waldnerish, awesome to watch him play. He will go straight to 1600 Vic points as his initial rating I think once he's played enough games. Hard to say how far past that he will go in the near future since he hasn't been playing and is still pretty rusty but he's got all the shots to go as far as he wants if he wants to practice

[speedplay]

1600 Vic points don't say much to me, as I don't have a clue about what level that is. How ever, if he did reach the final and got to play against Miao Miao, I suppose he is pretty sharp, despite having been out of the game for some time.

[JT]

He took the first game off her too and almost the 4th :0, It was really tight

[RebornTTEvnglist]

1600 Vic points don't say much to me, as I don't have a clue about what level that is. How ever, if he did reach the final and got to play against Miao Miao, I suppose he is pretty sharp, despite having been out of the game for some time.

1600 is bottom of sub-elite. Supachop is 1671.

[speedplay]

So, it's a respectable rating then, even though it's hardly a sign of an international player. What's Rob's rating? Reb, I know (or, at least think I know) that you don't have a rating, but if you did, what would it be?

Just when I thought I had a grasph of the USATT system, you guys introduce a new system Any ideas what 1600 Vic would be in USATT?

[JT]

So, it's a respectable rating then, even though it's hardly a sign of an international player. What's Rob's rating? Reb, I know (or, at least think I know) that you don't have a rating, but if you did, what would it be?

Just when I thought I had a grasph of the USATT system, you guys introduce a new system Any ideas what 1600 Vic would be in USATT?

1600 is where the unusually good players start. It is well over 2000 us, maybe like 2400 especially in the high 1600's. This is the level Supachop plays and as mentioned a while ago he's the current open champion for all players outside the metro area and there were plenty of young guys there that are very serious with their training and very good players.

There's a decent gap between the high 1400s where Rob usually is and mid 1600's. The Danish guy may end higher (or lower) than this too, he hasn't played enough games to really know but that seems to be where he's playing atm. I actually had a hit with Rob the other day, he's improved a fair bit from 6 months ago when we last played. I've improved too but the gap between us was bigger than before :S.

After having a go of his setup I thought to me that would be worth a hundred points alone!:) seriously good blade and rubber combination for someone that relies on heavy topspin like me, very easy to use, I need to get the same setup at some point soon. OSP Expert and Hexer (FH) Hexer duro (BH) was that right Rob?.

The Duro was ok hitting on the FH close to the table, it has a really noticeable lower throw than the standard Hexer but the standard stuff was sooooooo easy to use, I swear you could hardly miss a loop even if you were half blind. I don't know how much of the awesome was the rubber and how much was the blade but I've got an idea a fair bit of it was blade. I've hit with a few other higher level players setups that use things like T05 on TBS and other Butterfly blades but no of them were suiting me like this was.

[pingpongrob]

What's Rob's rating? Reb, I know (or, at least think I know) that you don't have a rating, but if you did, what would it be?

Just when I thought I had a grasph of the USATT system, you guys introduce a new system Any ideas what 1600 Vic would be in USATT?

Rob's is 1470

Supachop has a USATT Rating 2001 give or take 113

[supachop]

..Supachop has a USATT Rating 2001 give or take 113

No i dont.

[speedplay]

2400 seems a little high, especially for low 1600, considering Supa is high 1600, that would equal to way over 2500?

Then again, if the gap between Rob and Supa is big, and I've esimated Rob to be around 2000 USATT, it might be correct. Still, Rob did beat Supa fairly recently, and our US members will have to help out here, but for a 2000 player to beat a 2400 player in the US, it would take a miracle, right?

[pingpongrob]

No i dont.

That's what ratings central says.

[supachop]

That's what ratings central says.

Ratings central is not the same as USATT Rating.

[speedplay]

Yes, rating central seems to be a totally different system. 2001 Usatt on Supa seems way to low. My guess would be around 2300-2400, al though it's hard to make any estimations, as I've almost only seen Supa play against Rob. Then there is the clip against BB as well, but even though I've learnt to understand that BB is a good player, his awkward style makes it really hard to use his matches to estimate players level.

[JT]

Supachop is _really_ good, for a guy his age he's outstanding. It doesn't show up how good he is playing against Rob or anyone in the vets comp. When it shows up is when he's playing a kid that's hitting balls at him at twice the pace the vets play at, then you can see how good he is. As far as I know you guys haven't ever seen him pushed or playing at that level. The guy is a total legend, he plays in a daggy old jumper and tracksuit but you can tell he's ripped underneath all that.

Rob was just above 2000 or say around 2100 us in he's videos, he's got to be 2200+ as of last weekend, no problem at all, he still plays a division under supachop in the country champs (when supachop won both the vets and open).

Brian Berry is a weird weird player, I've seen him play in person and he looks like.... well really you feel like you could have the chance to beat him but at the same time you know he's the best. It's a strange thing to see. Someone like that is never going to be understood and wont let you see what the other guy plays like either.

[speedplay]

I have no problem understanding that Supa is a quality player, how ever, we have plenty of quality players here, which might be why we aren't as impressed with them.

Take Biggy as en example, I know for a fact that he would have slot in our second highest division, al though perhaps as a weaker player, he would have a slot in that division. When it comes to Supa, I don't know. I do know that as of current there is only one player in that division who is above 45 years of age, and that is Appelgren. Now given Supa's age, (which I don't know) do you think he would slot in to the same division as Appelgren?

I know it is very easy to admire people we see up close and think highly of their skill, I've done the same my self, but we must try to be realistic about it and even though these players might still play on a level we will never achieve our self, we have to understand that there are probably plenty of players out there that are better.

Take the 2400 Usatt=1600 Vic rating. How many 1600+ players are there in Vic and how many 2400+ players are there in the USA, then, does that make sense? It might, I haven't checked it out, but 2400 is a really high level.

[JT]

There's 31 players in the states on the 2400's and 13? in Vic in the 1600s although I'm thinking more in the high area's of 1600, 1650-1699 to be in the 2400 range. I know Europe has s higher average standard than either the States or Australia. But on average Australia seems to be more organised and have stronger players than they have in the States, at least we have umpires at tournaments :)??.

[RebornTTEvnglist]

2400 seems a little high, especially for low 1600, considering Supa is high 1600, that would equal to way over 2500?

Then again, if the gap between Rob and Supa is big, and I've esimated Rob to be around 2000 USATT, it might be correct. Still, Rob did beat Supa fairly recently, and our US members will have to help out here, but for a 2000 player to beat a 2400 player in the US, it would take a miracle, right?

I think you will find Rob is more like 2200-2300 USATT. Supachop would sit between 2400-2500 I'd say. As Biggie says though...its all speculation!

[speedplay]

I think you will find Rob is more like 2200-2300 USATT. Supachop would sit between 2400-2500 I'd say. As Biggie says though...its all speculation!

Seriously doubt it. I think this is once again a case of over estimating the players around you, while failing to recognise the level of players far away from you. With a rating at 2400-2500, Supa would earn a spot in our second highest league, and I'm sorry, I just don't see it. Supa is for sure a quality player, but I think you guys are thinking a little to much of him.

As for Rob, he claims to have improved, which might be true, but still 2200-2300 is a pretty high level.

[big ears]

Reb is proving my point beautifully, thanks reb!

[RebornTTEvnglist]

Reb is proving my point beautifully, thanks reb!

No worries...I'm just returning the favour!

[JT]

These guys here are very much the typical young player that's had coaching during his teenager years, there's heaps of guys like this around, the Vic rating on guys like this is typically between 1200 and 1500 points so most of them are outside the top 100 even though they are able to beat most the players inside the top 100. Supachop generally disposes of this kind of player easily, these are 2400 US level players. I would say quite a few players at country week were stronger again than these guys in the video

2009 Badger Open- U-2500 Final

I'm sure you have many hundreds if not thousands of young players this level in Europe, you can see 2400 US isn't all that high a rating

This is US 2000

1/20 Ping Pong Dojo U2000 League George Zhao vs. Mark Johnson 1/2

This is more like the level the rest of us play at (me, blue smartie and reb? and speedplay?) or + - 100 points of this depending on which of us your talking about. At least I would happily grudge match anyone in the US 2000-2100 range and I'm not at Robs level, it doesn't leave much room to stick him anywhere other than 2200-2300 us

This is under 2300

Salvador Uribe vs Fred Li U2300 4

Anyway, there's some thing to help you guys get clued up on the USTT rating system

[big ears]

JT, you are making it up as you go along, I think that you have very little experience. Those guys in the top clip would be Vic top 20 and would certainly outclass Rob. You really just don't know what to look for. I talk regularly to a REAL Vic top 20 standard player, infact I've been talking to him this morning, so I know exactly how good  you all are.

 Edit, he's just told me that they would be between 8 and 15 in Vic, but he's struggling to type for laughing at your suggestion that there are 'heaps' of players like that outside the vic top 100. you can't see their serves, footwork, recovery, power, consistency? Supachop would have a job on his hands I can tell you!!!!

[pingpongrob]

1/20 Ping Pong Dojo U2000 League George Zhao vs. Mark Johnson 1/2 - Victorian Division 2 or less
2009 Badger Open- U-2500 Final Definetely Metro 1, but at the top end
Salvador Uribe vs Fred Li U2300 4 - Division 1

Supachop Plays at least at this level 2009 Badger Open- U-2500 Final
Pingpongrob plays at this level Salvador Uribe vs Fred Li U2300 4
Pingpongrob play at the lower half of this level 2009 Badger Open- U-2500 Final, but is no walkover anymore.

[RebornTTEvnglist]

JT, you are making it up as you go along, I think that you have very little experience. Those guys in the top clip would be Vic top 20 and would certainly outclass Rob. You really just don't know what to look for. I talk regularly to a REAL Vic top 20 standard player, infact I've been talking to him this morning, so I know exactly how good  you all are.

Oh I didnt know you made a new contact out here Biggie? Who is it? Someone in the top 20 eh? I know a few personally, I wonder if its someone I know!

[big ears]

Oh I didnt know you made a new contact out here Biggie? Who is it? Someone in the top 20 eh? I know a few personally, I wonder if its someone I know!

 Of course you know him.

[big ears]

1/20 Ping Pong Dojo U2000 League George Zhao vs. Mark Johnson 1/2 - Victorian Division 2 or less
2009 Badger Open- U-2500 Final Definetely Metro 1, but at the top end
Salvador Uribe vs Fred Li U2300 4 - Division 1

Supachop Plays at least at this level 2009 Badger Open- U-2500 Final
Pingpongrob plays at this level Salvador Uribe vs Fred Li U2300 4
Pingpongrob play at the lower half of this level 2009 Badger Open- U-2500 Final, but is no walkover anymore.

 So supachop plays 'at least' as high as 42 upwards in USA does he, you've been on those fantasy tablets again Rob.

[speedplay]

Feels kind of weird to be on the defending end of the USATT rating, since I'm usually the one who tries to convince everyone that USATT 2000 isn't that impressive. How ever, it's still a respectable level, and even though I insist on calling anything less then this for noob level, I doubt that "most of us" play at this level.

Now, Reb might think this is me having a go at him, but it's not, I'm simply trying to clarify a little about the USATT 2000 rating. Not to long ago, Reb posted about his league results, and his regular team mate was unavailble, so he got a young girl to fill in for him. Not sure about here age, but I think Reb said she was 10-12 years old. Now, this girl managed to win both matches, while Reb lost both of his. Are we to assume that this girl was USATT 2000 or better, since she won, and Reb, who you have given the rating of 2000 USATT lost both of his? If so, she is a huge talent as I doubt that there are many girls at this age who plays at that level. I've played some of the better girls in Sweden, age 12-14 and I have yet to lose to any of them. And I doubt that I'm 2000, even though I think I'm pretty close, but more likely slightly below then above 2000.

When it comes to Supachop easily being of the same level as the guys in the clip of the U 2500, I'm more inclined to agree, even though I still think you guys might over-rate him some. I'm sure he is a great player, but 2300 is also a very good level. Remember, the higher up you go, the harder it becomes to earn points, so a difference between 2300 and 2500 is much bigger then between a 1500 and a 1700. How ever, you guys have seen Supa play up close, and I know how easy it is to be impressed with players who are better then us, when we see them play live. Watching it live, everything seems to be played at a higher pace then it does on video. It is easy to be sweapt away.
 
Not to mention how we look at our own game   We tend to think that it looks a certain way, but when we get to see it on video, we realise that we don't look the way we imagine. I know that when I first begun playing serious, and played in our regional league, I looked at some videos of USATT rated players and guessed my own rating to be roughly 2000 USATT. 3-4 years later, with huge improvements being made on my part, I think that I might be able to challenge a 2000 rated player, but I'm not there yet. On my best days, I might be able to play at 2000 level, but, when I'm giving my self an estimated rating, I can't look at my best days, I have to look at my entire game, including bad days as well. I know, it's easy to make up excuses for bad days, such as lack of sleep, injury or something else, but guess what? Despite these "excuses", the result counts and should be included when we try to sum up our level.