What to think about when using LP/Anti?

[speedplay]

I know, most of you guys use double inverted, but that is why I ask you, When you are faced with LP/Anti opponents, what are the main weaknesses you try to exploit and what should I do to cover up these weaknesses? Twiddle or move around more, set up the points so I prevent you from exploiting my weaknesses or something else?

Please advice me so I can cover up some of the worst flaws in my game.

[pingpongrob]

I know, most of you guys use double inverted, but that is why I ask you, When you are faced with LP/Anti opponents, what are the main weaknesses you try to exploit and what should I do to cover up these weaknesses? Twiddle or move around more, set up the points so I prevent you from exploiting my weaknesses or something else?

Please advice me so I can cover up some of the worst flaws in my game.

Speedplay, when facing an anti player/LP Player, not sure I try and exploit a weekness, cause at my level they mostly know how to use them correctly. They are not hiding an explicid weekness. The ones that do have a weekness that is hidden behind the LP/Anti is ussually beat with consistent returns.

[speedplay]

Rob, you are missing the point, I'm not talking about a player that hides his weakness, I thought we were passed that by now? I'm talking about what weaknesses you are exploiting against these opponents, cause the rubber it self is limited in it's action. So it's not about exploiting the players weaknesses, but the rubbers. 

[pingpongrob]

Rob, you are missing the point, I'm not talking about a player that hides his weakness, I thought we were passed that by now? I'm talking about what weaknesses you are exploiting against these opponents, cause the rubber it self is limited in it's action. So it's not about exploiting the players weaknesses, but the rubbers.

In good hands an anti is a deadly weapon, unless you are Schlager or Waldner. When I play an experienced player with Anti, I try and get him to pop the ball up by serving long and fast to it, but this doesn't always work, as its an old trick that they have gotten used to, the good anti players could always twiddle and use the smooth to return that ball.  I think SupaChops & BigEars experience might be needed to answer your question more fully.

[speedplay]

Yes, I look forward to their answers, cause I want to know which parts I need to work on. The long fast serve is something I'm used to and even though it still troubles me from time to time, I do think I know what to do against it.

[big ears]

The rubbers have invariably got weaknesses, the weaknesses being their physical limitations, and this is what is always exploited by experienced players, however good/experienced the anti/LP user is. The real weakness is the antipodes of their strength, the inability to spin a dead ball to a varying degree. Its the lack of friction that allows the spin to be retained on a ball throughout contact and without reversing the spinning axis (although confusingly its often called 'spin reversal')
So, its the lack of available friction that you exploit if you are faced with these rubbers.

The number one tactic is to deep push with or without heavy backspin long to the pips, the return is low spin or no spin so follow it up with a closed angle drive. Fortunately i can doo this equally well with either wing, so the tactic available to the LP user of positioning me awkwardly is lost to him.
The LP user has to stop this scenario at all costs either by hitting or twiddling or both.

So to third ball attack, a deep chopped serve to the Lp's followed by a closed angled drive is what you have to get around Speedy, it all starts to come down to quality of players though, for instance, If you twiddle, I could switch wings and still get to yr pips, it comes down to 'awareness' and brain to hand co-ordination, if you are a good class you will be able to twiddle as a response to my serve, if not you are in trouble.

[Der Echte]

I face a number of LP players here (only ONE guy, and numerous females). The players here are very predictable what they do with LP. I push deep to their BH or crossover, allow them to punch the return back at low to medium speed and tee off on their return for a winner or pressure. However, a number of them are craftier and more skilled. They have the ability to rush me with a faster punch stroke and ackward placement, as well as punish any high or long ball in their FH power zone. That cuts down my ability to pounce on them right away. B.E. just described major points of LP tactics and you already know the advantages/limitations of ur rubber(s) as well as your ability to make shots and apply tactical intellegence. As you gain level, you will be increasingly pressured to do something to disrupt the timing, anticipation of the opponent and must develop the ability to rush them somehow. This is something that you must discover and grow on your own. You must also develop an ability to crush certain shots  to yiour inverted that you can reasonably expect, plus do it deciseively with a very high percentage. A neato challenge and goal to look forward to. Speaking of goals, how do you like Bayern's last gasp goal vs Manchester United to win at home 2-1?

[speedplay]

Biggy, then I would be in trouble as I'm not yet quick enough to twiddle to receive serve, but I'm working on it.

Unlike the pro's, I try to return about 50% of the serves with inverted, cause at my level, the most important thing is to create variation as my opponents aren't skilled enough to make constant opening loops against my anti. I know that pro players are almost forced to return serve with their inverted side to prevent their opponent from getting to much of an advantage, but at my level, I think I win more points by using variation between the two rubbers.

My main weapon to prevent my opponent from open up to strong is to keep it short, al though it is a risky business, since a short shot that becomes a little to high is dangerous to me. Do you think this is how I should deal with it? Or, is there another way for me to work around it?

Also would like to add, my style is becoming more and more offensive, less chopping and more looping. Not sure why, but I guess the main reason is improved footwork and fh-loop, so I now step around a lot more to use my fh to attack and only resort to chopping if I'm forced away from the table.

Der_Echte, I'm currently working my bh pretty hard, inverted bh that is, to be able to punish week balls to that wing even when I don't have time to step around. The main problem now is mentality as I still hesitate to do this in real match situations, but along with more practice I think this will gradually become a natural part of my game.

Thanks for the advices this far.

[Der Echte]

Developing a medium pace hit at the top of bounce punch shot with Anti to an inconvenient location is a bridge for you to consider. You make a good point about failing to accurately read the spin and make a mistake on the short push - fatal result if left too high close to net - an easy putaway for the opponent. Might as well dare him to attack a long push with varied spin if you don't get the short push right consistant enough. You did not yet mention pressuring the opponent with a serve and 3rd ball attacking game. That has a lot of potential if you can learn to serve more deceptive and short/half-long/deep variations to get a ball in an attackable position.

[speedplay]

I do hit more with the anti then I used to, but since most of my practice partners have become used to it, they can return it with ease, often counter hitting it, putting me in trouble. I know, I should still continue to develop the stroke as it wins me points in matches against opponents that aren't used to face me, but... It is hard, confidence wise, to continue to make a stroke that I know will put me in trouble and since I don't do it much at practice, I tend to forget about it in matches as well. This is actually true for a lot of shots, once my practice partners have gotten used to them, I try to find new weapons that work against them and then I forget about the old ones that could still trouble my opponents who aren't used to them.

As for the third ball kill, I always aim for this when I serve and my skill to attack the third ball have improved a lot, I don't need the return to be particularly high to be able to attack it and I've3 gained a lot of confidence in this department, Still, the problem with playing/practising to much with the same people applies here as well. They get used to my serve and I get less and less returns to work with in practice, which makes it hard to improve further with out getting to play more matches.

[Der Echte]

Agree and disagree with you martin. yes, partners get used to serves and their effectiveness decreases. Disagree in that this creates two opportunities for you. 1) to develop better deceptiveness, tightness, low height, placement, speed, and break ... to make the service and attack game even better. This gets you to become even more of a better serve/attack player. 2) this also forces you to pay better attention to the quality of the shot you use for a setup.

I came to this club with serves that confounded 90 percent of the members. I show everyone how I make the service motion, impact, and follow through for all my serves. I want my club members to get good on my serve and I want them to not be fooled that much. That puts the pressure on me to better develop deception and keep it tight/low as well as makes me focus on better quality shots. A win-win opportunity.

[speedplay]

Yes, playing against people who are familiar with your serves does increase the pressure on making the serve even more deceptive to become successful, but it also leads me to make things more difficult then I have to when I play in real matches.