Aus vs Uk differing standards ( gulp)

[big ears]

Nothing much happening, so i thought I would throw this in and see what comes out.
Here is a clip of my team mate Emma Vickers, a current full international.

Emma Vickers at the English Open 2011

We play in Div two North British league, here are the current averages:

I think that the standard speaks for itself????

http://www.tabletennis365.com/sbl/player/averages/SBL_2011-12/Division_2_North

A question for you guys. Would Emma in your opinions, make it into the Vic premier league? I mean your highest standard division ?

 Look slightly up the averages to see my name. Now that is what you call DEPTH Mr Katsipis, our English number 5 lady, playing in Division two of our British League, but getting well below 50%
I would expect you to normally bring all kinds of statistics in, and argue all kinds of points, but the fact is, you can see Emma's standard right at the start of this post, how do you explain such a high standard of play, in only the second division of the British league.? BTW Emma easily top 5 In Aus ladies.

 Just for good measure, a report from last season;

gland no. 32 Simon Noutch whilst Andy Wignall was given the Player of the Match Award, courtesy of his victories  over Roman Doryn , Andy Wignall, clearly on good form won his second Player of the Match Award. This time he beat Emma Vickers (8-11, 13-11, 7-11, 12-10, 11-5) and David Arrowsmith after a gruelling encounter (10-12, 8-11, 11-9,11-9, 13-11).

 I'm probably only expecting a realistic answer from PocketRocket

[RebornTTEvnglist]

Realistic answer: Emma is obviously a very good player although the vid is a highlights clip, so it is made for her to look good. I agree she'd be highly ranked in Aus in womens, I don't know what number specifically. Not sure she'd be up to Miao Miao's level.

Obviously your boredom has lead you to re-ignite the BIG debate of the year on the forum on this depth and level issue Biggy. The only thing I definitely wouldn't debate you on here is Emma is a cutey!! But there's not much else I'll debate either. What would be interesting is seeing you playing Emma. Don't spose you got a vid of that?

[big ears]

lol, yes a bit of 'boredom and booze' Reb, a volatile cocktail where I am concerned, I feel a bit silly now, coz i'm not really that bothered, but at least it might get some posts going.

[RebornTTEvnglist]

lol, yes a bit of 'boredom and booze' Reb, a volatile cocktail where I am concerned, I feel a bit silly now, coz i'm not really that bothered, but at least it might get some posts going.

Well Biggy I have to congratulate you. Thats the nicest "drunk" post I have ever seen you do  Must mean you're improving  cos I would never have guessed you were under the influence! 

[PocketRocket]

So heres whats up,
During the first points of that clip, I thought the guy was mucking around. Then realised that's all he had.

Its good standard for division 2, but this girl would have no chance in our premier league, or even our metro league 1(division 2 when premier league is on).
Im sure Melissa Tapper would take this girl to the cleaners(hard to say as Ive only seen this english girl playing against weaker players then herself), as would the cambelines sisters, and a few of our junior girls, not even gonna mention the Chinese imports(miao ect).

I think she had those close matches with those guys you mentioned because she may have faced them a few times, and lets face it a good blocker is a ball breaker to play if its just pennant or leagues.

She has a good block(all girls do), no power on the forehand side(all arm), a nice backhand opener but that's all I see.

She would struggle in our division 2 as most of those players play some ugly table tennis and im not sure she would be up to overpowering all the choppers and blockers(although she is definitely faster then them).

Thoughts?

[pingpongrob]

So heres whats up,
During the first points of that clip, I thought the guy was mucking around. Then realised that's all he had.

Its good standard for division 2, but this girl would have no chance in our premier league, or even our metro league 1(division 2 when premier league is on).
Im sure Melissa Tapper would take this girl to the cleaners(hard to say as Ive only seen this english girl playing against weaker players then herself), as would the cambelines sisters, and a few of our junior girls, not even gonna mention the Chinese imports(miao ect).

I think she had those close matches with those guys you mentioned because she may have faced them a few times, and lets face it a good blocker is a ball breaker to play if its just pennant or leagues.

She has a good block(all girls do), no power on the forehand side(all arm), a nice backhand opener but that's all I see.

She would struggle in our division 2 as most of those players play some ugly table tennis and im not sure she would be up to overpowering all the choppers and blockers(although she is definitely faster then them).

Thoughts?

I havent watched the Video, as My Internet connection is Sloooooow (will do something about it in the New Year.
I can see where Wiggy is Coming from, and its even easier to see where he's going. But the fact is he's already been there - infact many times. What do you want to here. The UK has Depth - OK maybe you have, does it mean that you have better players - I doubt it, Does it mean you are better than me, Maybe, Maybe not. I already made the offer for you to come over, and I would Host you, lend you a car, feed you etc - Family and all. Would form a nice bond between us Aussie's and the Big Wiggy.
And guess what - you'd get to meet all the Forum Guy's and really show them how good you are. Now thats Food for thought.

[big ears]

So heres whats up,
During the first points of that clip, I thought the guy was mucking around. Then realised that's all he had.

Its good standard for division 2, but this girl would have no chance in our premier league, or even our metro league 1(division 2 when premier league is on).
Im sure Melissa Tapper would take this girl to the cleaners(hard to say as Ive only seen this english girl playing against weaker players then herself), as would the cambelines sisters, and a few of our junior girls, not even gonna mention the Chinese imports(miao ect).

I think she had those close matches with those guys you mentioned because she may have faced them a few times, and lets face it a good blocker is a ball breaker to play if its just pennant or leagues.

She has a good block(all girls do), no power on the forehand side(all arm), a nice backhand opener but that's all I see.

She would struggle in our division 2 as most of those players play some ugly table tennis and im not sure she would be up to overpowering all the choppers and blockers(although she is definitely faster then them).

Thoughts?

 The clip shown is from the English open, and she's playing a lady, not a man., although it looks like a man lol. Emma has an ITTF ranking of 675 which would put her 6 in Aus, ? in Vic ladies. You say she would have no chance in your second level? the level that Rob plays in? don't be silly.
http://www.ittfranking.com/gen/country/coENGW_en.htm

[big ears]

detailed results;

http://www.ittfranking.com/cgi-bin/ttplayer.cgi?number=112021&lang=0&format=detailed4

[JT]

Big ears, I think he might have meant there's 2 divisions in premier league, not the normal system?. I'm often playing in the normal division 2, I'm competitive there and she's lots better than that.

I don't think she would be as high as 7th in Australia since most of our girls aren't as active on the international scene and don't have the same amount of points as an English player. Melissa or Perri Campbell Innes are't even listed and both would be stronger players than 7th in England. She would be CLOSE to 7th here I guess but once you get out that far in the Womens ratings you are not far from Robs rating anyway, if that's what you are getting at?.

Henzel recently played a couple months in Europe and you can see here how much gain in rating he made in that short time just because he was exposed to players he can win points from, the same thing happens to any international worthy Australian player when they travel.

http://www.ittfranking.com/cgi-bin/ttplayer.cgi?number=103555&lang=0&format=summary

[PocketRocket]

When I typed Division 2, It was meant as our division below premier league, not as our ordinary division 2(where rob plays).

If she played here she would be put in division 1 but not in premier league, sorry for any misunderstanding.

That girl really did look like a guy, lol.

[JT]

Rob actually plays in the middle of Division 1 :) (normal Division 1).

[big ears]

I don't think she would be as high as 7th in Australia since most of our girls aren't as active on the international scene and don't have the same amount of points as an English player. Melissa or Perri Campbell Innes are't even listed and both would be stronger players than 7th in England. She would be CLOSE to 7th here I guess but once you get out that far in the Womens ratings you are not far from Robs rating anyway, if that's what you are getting at?.

 Remembering of course that your number 1 and 2 are Chinese. Emma would skin Rob alive.

[RebornTTEvnglist]

Rob actually plays in the middle of Division 1 :) (normal Division 1).

Ed wasn't talking Vets, he meant full strength pennant at MSAC I think.

[pingpongrob]

Emma would skin Rob alive.

Emma would have skinned the old Rob alive. I doubt she would skin the new Rob at all.
Ed, I don't play Premier League, but play Metro 1, which is about the right level for now. I'm still working on the next level, will take some time to sort out the new style, but getting there.
BigEars stop dreaming and enjoy the festive season.

[big ears]

Oh all-right then, you all seem like good guys to me, every one of you, Bollocks to the differing standards, Happy new year, and I sincerely mean it. You are all friends from my point of view, and a special mention for Reb, who I conversed with recently, and has made me think about things, thanks Reb.

[big ears]

Emma would have skinned the old Rob alive. I doubt she would skin the new Rob at all.
Ed, I don't play Premier League, but play Metro 1, which is about the right level for now. I'm still working on the next level, will take some time to sort out the new style, but getting there.
BigEars stop dreaming and enjoy the festive season.

So, Emma, training full time as a professional with the England camp, has lost ground against Rob,  Emma a full time pro, Rob a ? How does that work?

[big ears]

And Rob, please please, show us a clip of the new you, you talk the talk, walk the walk, but don't ever provide the juice, for maybe two/three yrs now, Why? Is it all bullshit?

[RebornTTEvnglist]

Oh all-right then, you all seem like good guys to me, every one of you, Bollocks to the differing standards, Happy new year, and I sincerely mean it. You are all friends from my point of view, and a special mention for Reb, who I conversed with recently, and has made me think about things, thanks Reb.

You're most welcome Biggy! I can admire a person who takes steps to improve their outlook and not just keep banging heads! Keep up the good work!

I agree we are all friends. A happy new year to all!

As for standards, the thing that strikes me more and more, is that as you increase in standard its like walking into a funnel (perhaps not the best analogy, but I can't think of a better one right now). The further you go, the less separates you from those around and ahead of you. Sometimes you will have days when you feel the guys higher are in your grasp and others you slide back a bit, or they step ahead. I think it depends on what the "prize" at the end of the funnel is and who wants it most as to how hard a player goes for it.

[pingpongrob]

And Rob, please please, show us a clip of the new you, you talk the talk, walk the walk, but don't ever provide the juice, for maybe two/three yrs now, Why? Is it all bullshit?

Dont talk the talk, and certainly dont walk the walk. You can think all you like. A trip would solve all your problems, you'd come out a victor (Victor Barna) and go back with bragging rights - Opp's is that talking the talk or walking the walk. 
Nah seriously, played Super League down at Coburg and didnt win a match, the new style is going to take some time to perfect.  I learnt a few things though and made some new friends, but have to say didnt get a chance to play or meet the infamous BLOCKER.

[big ears]

So heres whats up,
During the first points of that clip, I thought the guy was mucking around. Then realised that's all he had.

Its good standard for division 2, but this girl would have no chance in our premier league, or even our metro league 1(division 2 when premier league is on).
Im sure Melissa Tapper would take this girl to the cleaners(hard to say as Ive only seen this english girl playing against weaker players then herself), as would the cambelines sisters, and a few of our junior girls, not even gonna mention the Chinese imports(miao ect).


Thoughts?

Are you going to re-evaluate? based on the fact that (a) this is not a British league match

(b) Emma's opponent is not a man (c) She is representing England in a pro tour event (d) the 'guy' who gave 'all he had' was in fact the Swedish number 1 Lady Matilda Ekholm.
http://www.ittfranking.com/gen/country/coSWEW_en.htm world ranked 70, well above any of the Australian Chinese imports.

[JT]

I guess this argument will finally all be sorted out in the world vets champs 2014 in New Zealand right?, suggest you all get in training

[blue_smartie68]

Nar...too many earthquakes there mate :/

[JT]

There will be plenty of solid tables to hide under 

[big ears]

This thread has caused me massive problems, the player in question has seen the thread and somehow thinks that I am bringing her game down, as I'm sure you guys know, I was actually trying to bull her game up, please can you help me to put what I was trying to say into the context of the overall argument we have been having on here for ages. Help Reb!

[RebornTTEvnglist]

Dug yourself a hole Andy? lol. Well I think Emma needs to read the entire forum to put it all in context! Given that's a hard call, if she reads this then maybe she will find the right context.... which of course is that Big Ears here has been trying to tell us Aussies for ages how much better the English (including himself of course  ) are than us out here. And in doing so he has used many examples and vids. By showing a vid of Emma he was hoping to show how strong her game is, and by extrapolation how strong Andy's game is, given he has beaten Emma before. Personally I like watching Emma's vids cos not only is she a good TT player... but well we are guys and we like watching pretty girls hehe! Now of late old Andy there has pulled his head in a fair bit and realised that being friendly is more important than chest beating about TT skills. Kudos to him! So I think if we can put up with him and forgive him his transgressions, so can Emma! Cos he was trying to build (not bull) up Emma's game. And I'd extend an invite to Emma to join in here and chat with us too. She'd soon get the hang of Andy's alter-ego here 

[big ears]

thanks Reb, I owe you one.